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C50_11845184_10156112719890397_2264973958777799173_o_1448634398 Ridelow Quote
10/6/2017 12:58 AM

Just trying to tap into the unlimited knowledge of the Vitard community

Im thinking of getting a Enduro bike with license plates. I have a couple of tracks close (0,5 km to the closest) but the hassle of loading everything up and driving is cutting into my seat time, since I cannot braap from the garage to the track.

So im going to buy a bike with license plates as my second.... errr.... third bike... The choice is between the Husky FE /Ktm EXC-F 450 or the Honda CRF 450RX..

Since im mostly a track guy I would like to know how the Xplor forks/shock work on a track compared to the AER.. Also, KTM's use the PDS still but husky has a linkage.. My 2002 KTM250SXS had the PDS and I hated that bike apart from the engine.

I dont know much about the Honda 450RX but is this a better starting point for a MX bike with plates?

I will be riding some trails as well but main focus is on MX..

Any advice? my local dealer sells all three bikes.




C50_images_1483501291 Moto_Geek Quote
10/6/2017 1:40 AM

I have the 2014 KTM 300 XC and in 5 minutes, remove the light on front put the number plate back on the front, and go lapping 4 strokes just for fun.

If your a motcross guy, then you will appreciate the close gear box and the linkage moto feel in the rear as you mention when back on the track. I could never get a wide range enduro bike to feel right on a motocross track. I've converted 3 of my friend from 4 strokes to 300 2 stroke by just letting them ride my bike for few miles.

Then I love putting back on the enduro light and lisc. plate and hit the pavement to get to my favorite trail head. Having a plate really opens up your options trail riding, special if you want cut out early to the road and take the easy back if your tired or have a problem with the bike.

Suspension is a very broad topic.. how tall are you, what weight? I've always been able to tame a bike for for my preference through springs and valving. I almost recommend this to all track riders for the sure safety of it. You have to tame your beast for your weight so Bertha does not buck you off.

Just waiting for them to send over the 300 TPI XC's!!! 2019???

P.S. I through in some american slang just to f with you!

C50_101843880_1252836745 skypig Quote
10/6/2017 1:50 AM

The suspension requirements are poles apart.
As mentioned the WR gearboxes are not right. (Hardest to fix)
Power delivery is softer on off roaders. Often detuned with cams/valve size/etc.

Replacing lights with number plates makes them look like MX bikes......


(I find MX bikes horrid to ride on most trails, for most of the above reasons - horses for courses.)

C50_img_5136_1467213560 JMX82 Quote
10/6/2017 2:00 AM

As others already said the biggest problem is that Enduro model gear box ratios suck on motocross track. Suspension can be tuned for motocross use by local suspension shop but getting gear ratios that work on motocross tracks requires you to get gear box gears from mx model gearbox and replace enduro model gears with them.

C50 ratonmacias Quote
10/6/2017 4:49 AM

They Honda has the same gearbox and suspensiion components as its mx model. Just get rid of the enduro tank and moto away. If its too soft just set up the shock and forks for mx. You cant compare an xplor fork vs an almost kit showa.

C50_0611171249_1_1502895901 RCF Quote
10/6/2017 5:14 AM

If you go with a KTM you can even plate the sx model the XC might be a better option though you would have one extra gear for on the road and it already has lighting coil, the xc-w models wouldn't be very good on the MX track those bikes are designed for slow technical riding old school Hare Scramble.
KTM and husky are also easier to plate then Japanese bikes they come with clean titles they don't say for off-road use only

C50_11845184_10156112719890397_2264973958777799173_o_1448634398 Ridelow Quote
10/6/2017 6:33 AM

Thanks for the feedback.

So the consensus is that the CRF450RX is a better starting point than the Austrian brands with the MX gearing and just need to stiffen up the suspension to be able to enjoy it on a track?

I am currently on a Suzuki 450 with full tuned Öhlins setup which I love!

To bad I cannot demo the bikes before..

Yeah and another thing.. how is the 300 2stroke on a track? I have a 2008 KX250 as well and enjoy it but I usually end up riding the 4stroke..

C50_img_0520_1503873304 m.hardesty16 Quote
10/6/2017 6:36 AM

To lazy to load up to ride.. I don’t think using an enduro bike is to enjoyable on the track especially if it has all lights, plate and stuff.

C50_2014_04_11_22.55.15_1413514143 Johnny Depp Quote
10/6/2017 6:37 AM

Enduro bikes are not your father's Buick Park Avenue. Underneath they are essentially the same bikes. If you put them on the track at the same time, and record lap times you will see it's the rider, not the bike.

Forget the PDS for MX, it feels dead on jump faces, no lift.
The closed vs. open cartridge fork thing is way over rated, a good tuner can make either one great, if you are A level get the CC .
Having a suspension setup work for MX and Off road is not difficult, springs and setup will get you there.

Close ratio gearboxes are also over rated, many top MX riders are keeping their bikes a gear high and lugging for better results. The Alta with no gearbox or clutch is a good example of how less shifting can be a big benefit.

Steel frames have advantages in comfort and hard pack.

The KTM and Husky's have a reputation for needing remapping in the US. You might want to consider the XC models if you can get them since they are not emission tuned.

The Beta is a viable alternative.

2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

C50_11845184_10156112719890397_2264973958777799173_o_1448634398 Ridelow Quote
10/6/2017 6:54 AM
m.hardesty16 wrote:

To lazy to load up to ...more

Well basically, I ride about 3 times a week, but loading up bikes, gear and driving a car 0,3 miles, unloading for a quick afternoon session and then do the same is not ideal
My intention is to have a bike I can just jump on and go spin some laps whenever the urge hits..

Maybe I should just go with the Husky 450, slap some cone valve and trax shock on it and call it the day

C50_2014_04_11_22.55.15_1413514143 Johnny Depp Quote
10/6/2017 7:04 AM

Of the 3 you mentioned, the Husky would be my choice. If you could bolt on Cone valves and Trax you would have a bucket list bike right there. I guess you can't plate the Suzuki?

You mentioned 2 strokes, they are very viable. Beta is leading the EnduroGP's on a 300 2t against all types of engines and if you kept up with the last race at Hawkstone Park it had no problem running up front on the MX course. You can even get one with oil injection if you want to get further away from the truck and garage. 2 strokes are especially desired for their light weight if you go extreme enduro riding.


2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

C50_599423_10150932000263681_1040366485_n_1452047666 ruy Quote
10/6/2017 7:06 AM


I have an enduro to do MX. KTM EXC 300 2012
The good displacement for me is the 300 2 strokes, the engine is softer than the cross and allows me to take better advantage of it.
Suspensions, front needs to put closed cartridges, and on the rear shock you have to take it to a preparer and tune it. as standard enduro suspensions are too soft and bouncy.
The odometer has to be removed, as it is expensive, and breaks with jumps and bumps, and put an hour count.
Back I put a quick and easy connection to be able to connect and disconnect the rear lights better.
Sometimes light bulbs melt and break by doing MX
When it comes to selling, it sells much better than an MX.
C50_599423_10150932000263681_1040366485_n_1452047666 ruy Quote
10/6/2017 7:14 AM


And then it allows me to circulate and do enduro.



C50_dancing_girl walleyeguy Quote
10/6/2017 7:33 AM

I just posted this in another thread. Look at the fx350 I plated mine for about $500after I bought the tusk lighting kit through Rockymountainatc.com for $200 and a trail tech speedo for $80 an LED headlight off amazon for $40 and got my stator from Rickystator for $200 to run the extra lights. I took it the mx track for the first time this weekend and it was every bit as good "fun" as my 14 yz250f. I would not go with the FE myself because of all the "detuning" that is on the FE.

C50_2014_04_11_22.55.15_1413514143 Johnny Depp Quote
10/6/2017 10:34 AM

A do it all bike is realistic for having fun. Swap wheel sets or not, take off the lights or not. Drive it to work, or line up and race. It's all good.







2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

C50_11845184_10156112719890397_2264973958777799173_o_1448634398 Ridelow Quote
10/6/2017 1:37 PM

wow thanks for the feedback, goodstuff!

@Mr. Depp : No I cant plate it, as I know of, its bought in Norway new and is located in Southern Spain now. Dang I need to get a demobike of the new ktm 300 and see what the fuss is about, My KX250 wears me out too fast compared to my way to pimped out Suzuki. but then again, its more of a project bike.

@Ruy: Where are you located? I live in Tarifa, the most southern point.. looks like u got some nice riding areas around!

@walleyeguy: The FX is unfortunately not sold in Europe as I know of. That would be an awesome alternative.

How "detuned" is the FE and EXC-F line compared to the MX brothers? Is it just gearing/mapping and the silencer or is there something else?

Saludos and thanks again!




C50_100238980_1294767206 peelout Quote
10/6/2017 1:44 PM

if you don't have a kickstand then f*ck you

kcco

C50_img_20170926_230650_01_1506485286 Timo_2824 Quote
10/6/2017 1:55 PM

I moto my WR and surprise a lot of people with it. It is basically a YZF with a kickstand and lights...

C50_599423_10150932000263681_1040366485_n_1452047666 ruy Quote
10/6/2017 2:09 PM

@Ridelow I am in Galicia, but I think you have good areas for enduro and also good MX tracks in Andalucia

C50_img_20161226_wa0003_1482790793 Berni Quote
10/6/2017 2:46 PM
Ridelow wrote:

wow thanks for the ...more

Hey, I live in Marbella, pretty close to tarifa.... For the type of tracks that we have around. I am sure that an enduro bike is good enough for anyone.....

Beside the bike..... Are there any good trails in Tarifa to ride enduro?. I Know in San Roque and in Medina Sidonia there are a lot of places to ride, but dont know about Tarifa.

And if you want to know my neck of the woods, look for me on facebook: bernardo.guerreromarquez

C50_2014_04_11_22.55.15_1413514143 Johnny Depp Quote
10/6/2017 4:46 PM

Ridelow,

"Dang I need to get a demobike of the new ktm 300" Again you can't get the XC, check out the Husky for linkage.

"How "detuned" is the FE and EXC-F line compared to the MX brothers? Is it just gearing/mapping and the silencer or is there something else? " Not really much, you can easily get the Euro map, not sure it may come with it.

2015 Beta 500 RS, history: 99 KTM 300, 87 CR250, 84 KLR 600, 82 GPZ 550, 81 KX 250, 80 KX 250, 79 Montesa 414 VE, 78 250 VB, 77 360 VB, 76 360 VA, 75 YZ 125, 74 TM 125, 72 TS 125, 60's West Bend Go Boy Kart

C50_2_1473411318 brash Quote
10/6/2017 5:33 PM

I had an 09 TE450 that I set up for Mx. The forks took a lot of trial and error to get right but the sachs shock was surprisingly good just needed heavier spring. That engine made stupid amounts of power and had a very unique sound. I really enjoyed it but it got tiring very quick when you compared it to a modern 450MX bike.

I could race that bad boy on sunday and legally ride it to work the next day

C50_20170404_201105_1507772502 ama530 Quote
10/6/2017 7:19 PM
walleyeguy wrote:

I just posted this in ...more

FX350 here also. Best of both worlds in this bike. Super light feeling and has plenty of HP. I do both scrambles and moto. I did go down to a 13T front sprocket for tight stuff here in PA. It actually helped with moto also to keep the rpms a little higher in corners. With the wide ratio 6 speed, you don't have to worry about top end. Top end is ridiculous. I can ride this bike longer and faster than I could the RMZs I raced for the last 9 years. If you get it plated up you have a smoking dual sport. The FE model is a great off road bike but I don't think I would moto with it. Sherco & Beta are fantastic choices also.

C50_gp3_1.1 wildbill Quote
10/6/2017 7:36 PM

Apparently, MXGP bros use enduro suspension so I think you're on to something.

C50_s1600_tumblr_muriyfrnsx1r46py4o1_1280_1381979943_1413511971 Crush Quote
10/6/2017 7:47 PM

FWIW, my KTM 300 was easier to ride with the stock silencer on it than the PC one, on track and off-road. The suspension was never perfect for MX, it just felt soft, but it wasn't bad, and certainly worse was my KTM 350 suspension in the sticks.

Google Johnny Walker or Mathew Philips, they shred moto on their enduro bikes with PDS pretty regularly. 100% those bikes can do both!

Cheers, Crush
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C50_vital_mx_1407154577 wfo4ever Quote
10/6/2017 10:19 PM

This is how we did it 50 years ago.

C50_21320_rvplate HenryA Quote
10/7/2017 2:30 AM

You will hate everything enduro related on the MX track if you're on a RMZ with full Öhlins setup today. And remember that you need insurance if you're riding on the road. And lights, license plate, indicators,horn etc..
The road/asphalt will EAT your tires and you will also stack up the engine hours = no bueno.

I would get a cheap Skoda pick-up or a Vw Caddy and load the bike on the back of it. You will load the bike in 2-3 minutes, you could carry more fuel, tools and spare parts. And since they are so cheap you really don't need to bother about it getting a few scratches here and there.

#1
KX125

C50_18290113_1019998028136411_1270589478_o_1493931076 Motofinne Quote
10/7/2017 2:34 AM
HenryA wrote:

You will hate everything ...more

This^

C50_mx_bear_1457753510 Bearuno Quote
10/7/2017 4:21 AM
peelout wrote:

if you don't have a ...more

Well, if You don't have a Center Stand, then double Fuck You!!!!




Just kidding. I looked over to my welding / linishing bay here in my workshop, and spotted the stainless steel center stand I made for one of my XR / CR hybrids before the 92 Six Day here in OZ. Your comment made me finally take it down and take a few pictures - it was a complicated thing, to clear the AMP Torque Eliminator (that's what the chain roller and 'gull winged' cross bracing is for, to get the arms right up into the side covers / subframe - as the lower chain line is lower than std with the AMP T.E.) I used at the time, and made out of very thin walled (it is lighter than most side stands) Stainless in a few frenzied hours of Mad Hatterism:


I loved the bloody thing. And have missed having one on my subsequent bikes over the years. As goofy / unusual as they are in these times on dirt bikes, when you've got one, it's so good for working on your bike, especially out in the scrub. I'll eventually make one to fit my CRE500 - I've a linkage mount left over on the frame after making it a PDS'd bike, that will make it an easier job.

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