2 stroke: 250 vs 300

Csb146
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Csb146
Edited Date/Time 4/22/2020 8:42pm
I've been leaning more and more towards getting into off road/GP style riding vs moto stuff and was curious what the differences (beside the obvious) in a 250 vs 300 2 stroke were, and what factors to take into consideration when choosing between them. I'm 5'11 150 so I'm tall lanky dude (Think Marv minus the talent). I have pretty limited experience riding 2 strokes in general. Most of my 2 stroke experience comes from karting, and I've ridden 250/450 4 strokes forever, but I think I'm ready to change.
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loftyair
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loftyair 4/21/2020 8:39am
4/21/2020 8:39am
250 better for revs, 300 for low end riding. You could make a 300 Rev, with a stroker instead of just bore, and other things. A 250 has plenty of power for 150# rider.
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Broseph
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Broseph 4/21/2020 8:55am
4/21/2020 8:55am
loftyair wrote:
250 better for revs, 300 for low end riding. You could make a 300 Rev, with a stroker instead of just bore, and other things. A...
250 better for revs, 300 for low end riding. You could make a 300 Rev, with a stroker instead of just bore, and other things. A 250 has plenty of power for 150# rider.
They rev to the same rpm and have nearly the same hp. The 250 feels like it revs better because it makes less power down low and the power is still building in the upper revs. The 300 makes more torque and flatlines a bit on top.


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Ryan625
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Ryan625 4/21/2020 9:06am
4/21/2020 9:06am
I ride a TC250 husky on MX tracks, and my dads spare TPI 300xc-w when I ride off-road with him. The 300 is a torque monster and is nasty when it comes into the pipe. My TC is a race motor, a little less bottom end but enough, and a very healthy mid to top.
MZ193
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MZ193 4/21/2020 9:46am
4/21/2020 9:46am
Track: 250
Anything else: 300
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LOOnatic
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LOOnatic 4/21/2020 9:49am
4/21/2020 9:49am
Cant go wrong with either. My current bike is a 300xcw . To me the 300 is perfect if your coming off a 4 stroke because it has good bottom end power.
My buddies 250 xcw hauls butt plenty but i still prefer the 300.
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b_kowalsk
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b_kowalsk 4/21/2020 9:59am
4/21/2020 9:59am
If you are racing consider which class you want to run too. 300's obviously you will have to race against the 450's in the open class.
Stuntman949
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Stuntman949 4/21/2020 10:12am
4/21/2020 10:12am
b_kowalsk wrote:
If you are racing consider which class you want to run too. 300's obviously you will have to race against the 450's in the open class.
This
ktm 125
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ktm 125 4/21/2020 10:32am
4/21/2020 10:32am
300 for tight trails is a pain. a lot of people here in europe watch jarvis and go and by a 300 only to find out its too much. its only ideal for fat people because they need the extra torque to get a move on, old people because they dont like riding on the pipe anymore and they use the bike like a trial bike 1st gear foot down and off we go with 50 rpm they do hillclimb, or VERY VERY fast enduro riders that 250 is not enough for them.
but im only speaking about hard, rocky and tight enduro trails. in other surface its a very good bike!
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GPrider
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GPrider 4/21/2020 10:38am
4/21/2020 10:38am
great thread as I am in the same boat. Leaning toward a 250 xc as I want to race it off road as well as trail ride
dimesandrhymes 4/21/2020 10:50am
4/21/2020 10:50am
get a 250. My buddy bought a 2017 300xcw and the only time he ever gets his moneys worth is when he rips it up the street once every month. too many people get the 300 to say they have a 300. I saw a dude with a brand new crf450 at the track busting it out for the first ride and bragging about it, then proceeding to eat shit over a double and putting it up for sale the next week on facebook lol. the 250 will do everything you need it to do, kaliub russell won a GNCC on a KTM 150 so keep that in mind
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Derpin' DJ
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Derpin' DJ 4/21/2020 12:52pm
4/21/2020 12:52pm
Get a 250, and get the head modded (although I think you have to buy heads for FI bikes). Get carby or FI tuned, and your 250 will have plenty of power. Considering the price gap between 250 and 300, the 250 should still come out cheaper
NMX168
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NMX168 4/21/2020 1:24pm
4/21/2020 1:24pm
I have raced both in enduro and hare scrambles events. I am 5' 3" and about 135. During a 3 hour hare scramble, I loved the 300 for the first 2 hours and the 3rd hour the 300 wore me down. I switched to a 250 and adjusted to the bike well and the 3rd hour I was in better control. I have also raced a 200sx KTM in the woods and it was the stuff for me. The 300 is an easier bike to ride until you are tired. But by then maybe any bike might be difficult to ride. The 300 is better for someone who doesn't rev the guts out of a bike and tends to lug around more. You have to be more on the ball on a 250 and attack more when doing serious rides and terrain.
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philG
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philG 4/21/2020 3:19pm
4/21/2020 3:19pm
Raced a TM300 for 4 seasons in SM and had an MX one.. for me its a lot less abrupt than a 250, and easier to ride for a 220lb Vet guy.. we had Eric Gorr do some cylinder and VHM did some heads, and the thing ran with a 450 on tarmac with my fat ass on it... we went to a bored and stroked motor, to 330, it didn't rev with the longer stroke and bigger piston.

The 300 for me is a less frenzied bike.. if you want to go fast without trying to hard , its the bike.. but I have zero woods experience..
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DYE
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DYE 4/21/2020 4:56pm
4/21/2020 4:56pm Edited Date/Time 4/21/2020 4:57pm
I’m 5’11 175 and I race a 250 xc off-road upper pack B level. Absolutely love the bike. It’s got plenty of grunt for anything you’d need racing. If you were riding super tight/technical single track the 300 would be the answer for sure. For you depends on your riding style. Are you a revver or ride in the lower range.

Edit: plus it’s fun to moto
1983YZ125
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1983YZ125 4/21/2020 5:15pm
4/21/2020 5:15pm Edited Date/Time 4/21/2020 5:53pm
I'm 145 lbs and ride a Beta 300.

Absolutely great for low end torque to get up obstacles with minimal run up and technical sections its happy to lug. It fits my riding style very well (riding a gear or two higher than needed majority of the time).

Best trail bike i've owned to date and no complaints from the motor.

Edit: This was my first 2 stroke. Everything prior i owned in my riding "career" were 4 strokes which i thought i liked more. It was nothing like the YZ85 and KTM 200SX i jumped on once or twice that friends owned. Zero desire to switch back to a 4 stroke and 2 strokes sound cooler!
DYE
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DYE 4/21/2020 5:27pm
4/21/2020 5:27pm Edited Date/Time 4/21/2020 5:31pm
Johnny Depp
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Johnny Depp 4/21/2020 7:53pm
4/21/2020 7:53pm
Why stuck on 2t? What kind of riding and what floats your boat?
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Rick Amatuzio 4/22/2020 3:46am
4/22/2020 3:46am
loftyair wrote:
250 better for revs, 300 for low end riding. You could make a 300 Rev, with a stroker instead of just bore, and other things. A...
250 better for revs, 300 for low end riding. You could make a 300 Rev, with a stroker instead of just bore, and other things. A 250 has plenty of power for 150# rider.
Broseph wrote:
They rev to the same rpm and have nearly the same hp. The 250 feels like it revs better because it makes less power down low...
They rev to the same rpm and have nearly the same hp. The 250 feels like it revs better because it makes less power down low and the power is still building in the upper revs. The 300 makes more torque and flatlines a bit on top.


What am I looking at on this graph?
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DA498
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DA498 4/22/2020 4:57am
4/22/2020 4:57am
Rick Amatuzio wrote:
What am I looking at on this graph?
Two guys figured it out Rick, I’m with you though. That was my first thought as well.
navalseabee
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navalseabee 4/22/2020 5:30am
4/22/2020 5:30am
When i was racing in the woods a lot i vastly prefered the 250 over the 300. I got to ride the same year (2017) 250 and 300 XC model back to back multiple times, i always came away liking the 250 more. I think its all personal preference, they are very close to one another on paper but feel very different. Try to find them both a give each a try. 10k is a big pill to swallow make sure you like the bike before you buy.
Bearuno
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Bearuno 4/22/2020 6:09am
4/22/2020 6:09am Edited Date/Time 4/22/2020 6:14am
philG wrote:
Raced a TM300 for 4 seasons in SM and had an MX one.. for me its a lot less abrupt than a 250, and easier to...
Raced a TM300 for 4 seasons in SM and had an MX one.. for me its a lot less abrupt than a 250, and easier to ride for a 220lb Vet guy.. we had Eric Gorr do some cylinder and VHM did some heads, and the thing ran with a 450 on tarmac with my fat ass on it... we went to a bored and stroked motor, to 330, it didn't rev with the longer stroke and bigger piston.

The 300 for me is a less frenzied bike.. if you want to go fast without trying to hard , its the bike.. but I have zero woods experience..
Ah, the "Stroking for higher revs" chestnut that some come out with! As you said, a longer stroke just won't rev compared to a shorter stroke, given the same state of tune, as a control. And, of course in your case, the bigger (than 72mm?) piston on top of that.

That I see statements from people saying a longer stroke will give more revs - well, it does make me wonder about their ICE ideas ....

I've seen your bikes / your racing a 300 in SM for quite some time. That you can be competitive against 450s is quite something, given that they can Rev to the moon (plus, the extra / lesser 50% / 33.3%, depending on how you look at the difference in capacity) - what's the general 450 stroke range, something like 60mm to 64mm? It's says something about 300cc 2ts, being that they are, mostly, just over bored, to 'square', 250s, with a 72mm stroke .


250 or 300cc 2t ? - as most people say, it comes down to what you prefer - there's no definitive answer.
peelout
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peelout 4/22/2020 8:50am
4/22/2020 8:50am
ktm 125 wrote:
300 for tight trails is a pain. a lot of people here in europe watch jarvis and go and by a 300 only to find out...
300 for tight trails is a pain. a lot of people here in europe watch jarvis and go and by a 300 only to find out its too much. its only ideal for fat people because they need the extra torque to get a move on, old people because they dont like riding on the pipe anymore and they use the bike like a trial bike 1st gear foot down and off we go with 50 rpm they do hillclimb, or VERY VERY fast enduro riders that 250 is not enough for them.
but im only speaking about hard, rocky and tight enduro trails. in other surface its a very good bike!
this is probably the dumbest thing i've ever read on here, and that's saying a lot
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crusty_xx
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crusty_xx 4/22/2020 8:56am
4/22/2020 8:56am
ktm 125 wrote:
300 for tight trails is a pain. a lot of people here in europe watch jarvis and go and by a 300 only to find out...
300 for tight trails is a pain. a lot of people here in europe watch jarvis and go and by a 300 only to find out its too much. its only ideal for fat people because they need the extra torque to get a move on, old people because they dont like riding on the pipe anymore and they use the bike like a trial bike 1st gear foot down and off we go with 50 rpm they do hillclimb, or VERY VERY fast enduro riders that 250 is not enough for them.
but im only speaking about hard, rocky and tight enduro trails. in other surface its a very good bike!
my wife rides a TE300 bro
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tk2stroke
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tk2stroke 4/22/2020 8:42pm
4/22/2020 8:42pm
Primarily slow technical riding = 300
Hybrid slow and fast = 250

The 250 does the slow technical stuff really well, but not quite as well as a 300. However, on fast flowy trails, desert or moto, the 250 outshines the 300 by a noticeable margin While the dyno shows them fairly equal at top end, the 250 is much more playful and less bound up like the 300. Ride a 300 and 250 back to back in whooped out terrain and the difference is stark.
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