KTM/HUSKY teams all using a new triple clamp ?

Craig_Whitfield
Edited Date/Time 11/15/2021 2:09pm
I’ve noticed that a lot of the KTM/HUSKY teams are all using what looks like the powerparts triple clamps ?

Just finished watching “Red Bull Moto spy” and couldn’t help but notice.

Looks like a similar design to the xtrig mounts ?

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Motofinne
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Motofinne 1/3/2020 5:05am
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Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




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Craig_Whitfield 1/3/2020 5:09am
1/3/2020 5:09am
Motofinne wrote:
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395835/s1200_powerparts.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395834/s1200_XTRIG_Clamps_ROCS_53158_12096.1549027508.jpg[/img]
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




Interesting that the teams have now opted to use this. I know Kris Keefer tested the clamp and was a great fan of the powerparts one.
ktmwoods
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ktmwoods 1/3/2020 5:25am
1/3/2020 5:25am
Looks to be a very intelligent design that allows some pretty specific flex and rigidity tuning, makes a lot of sense for micro suspension / fork adjustments.
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Jmicmoto13
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Jmicmoto13 1/3/2020 6:13am
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Motofinne wrote:
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395835/s1200_powerparts.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395834/s1200_XTRIG_Clamps_ROCS_53158_12096.1549027508.jpg[/img]
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a patent infringement?
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mx317
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mx317 1/3/2020 7:07am
1/3/2020 7:07am
It comes on the Rockstar Huskys and FEs, but of course it is not for the 52mm forks that they run.
tek14
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tek14 1/3/2020 7:16am
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Motofinne wrote:
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395835/s1200_powerparts.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395834/s1200_XTRIG_Clamps_ROCS_53158_12096.1549027508.jpg[/img]
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




Jmicmoto13 wrote:
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a...
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a patent infringement?
Do they have patent for opening between upper and lower part?
mx317
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mx317 1/3/2020 7:26am
1/3/2020 7:26am


Photo stolen from Vital
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Motofinne
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Motofinne 1/3/2020 7:30am
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Motofinne wrote:
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395835/s1200_powerparts.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395834/s1200_XTRIG_Clamps_ROCS_53158_12096.1549027508.jpg[/img]
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




Jmicmoto13 wrote:
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a...
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a patent infringement?
tek14 wrote:
Do they have patent for opening between upper and lower part?
I have no idea but i would guess they have a patent on the opposite clamping design which is the big USP with the Xtrig ROCS clamp.
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FGR01 1/3/2020 7:33am
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Motofinne wrote:
I have no idea but i would guess they have a patent on the opposite clamping design which is the big USP with the Xtrig ROCS...
I have no idea but i would guess they have a patent on the opposite clamping design which is the big USP with the Xtrig ROCS clamp.
Their website mentions no patents at all for the ROCS. Not saying there are none, but it's odd it would not be prominently mentioned.
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mx317
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mx317 1/3/2020 7:42am
1/3/2020 7:42am
I remember reading that they were more rigid than the solid design. It would seem to be the opposite.
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Dimblewambie 1/3/2020 7:55am
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Motofinne wrote:
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design. [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395835/s1200_powerparts.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/01/03/395834/s1200_XTRIG_Clamps_ROCS_53158_12096.1549027508.jpg[/img]
Yep they all run it (GP teams too). But it isn't quite like the Xtrig design.




Jmicmoto13 wrote:
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a...
Pretty dang similar. I'm sure there is material added and subtracted in certain areas for rigidity purposes. But how much closer could they get to a patent infringement?
You should have a longer look, there isn’t much similar between the 2 besides they are triple clamps and come with bearings.
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Momus
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Momus 1/3/2020 10:43am
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mx317 wrote:
I remember reading that they were more rigid than the solid design. It would seem to be the opposite.
It looks like they are trying to minimise any operational piston bore distortion by designing for strength through selective weakness.
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Bruce372
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Bruce372 1/3/2020 10:53am
1/3/2020 10:53am
There was a thread on this a while back with an xtrig video showing reduction friction from their clamping mechanism.
Jmicmoto13
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Jmicmoto13 1/3/2020 11:19am
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Dimblewambie wrote:
You should have a longer look, there isn’t much similar between the 2 besides they are triple clamps and come with bearings.
Seriously? They're not that similar? You need a new prescription? Outside of the more rounded edges and bolts being on the same side on the PowerParts version, you wouldn't be able to tell them apart on a bike just casually walking by and observing.
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Cashmore 1/3/2020 11:56am
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Dimblewambie wrote:
You should have a longer look, there isn’t much similar between the 2 besides they are triple clamps and come with bearings.
Jmicmoto13 wrote:
Seriously? They're not that similar? You need a new prescription? Outside of the more rounded edges and bolts being on the same side on the PowerParts...
Seriously? They're not that similar? You need a new prescription? Outside of the more rounded edges and bolts being on the same side on the PowerParts version, you wouldn't be able to tell them apart on a bike just casually walking by and observing.
Maybe you need the prescription there bud. Take another good HARD look... lots of differences. SMH. In fact I only see one similar attribute. Take a look at the top clamp, completely different.

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Luxon MX
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Luxon MX 1/3/2020 12:49pm
1/3/2020 12:49pm
Well, these aren't new, they've been out for over a year now. And I believe they're made by Neken as that's who has been making their clamps in the past. Regardless, there are two main features in the KTM/Husky clamps that make them interesting:

1) They have a split clamping surface, similar to the Xtrig, but not an opposing clamp like the Xtrig. There's no real advantage to the opposing bolts aside from marketing; we've tested it (yes they have a video showing a difference, but I can create a video with two identical clamps having completely different resistance to the bushings too Laughing ).

There are two slight advantages to the split lower clamp, though: it's easier to torque the bolts properly (a non-issue if you know what you're doing on any clamp design), and it allows a smoother transition as the fork tube bends under load, which allows the bushing to slide through a little easier. It's noticeable, but not a huge advantage by any means. This second advantage is only realized on the lower clamp, the upper makes no difference if it's split or not. We've tested all this as well.

There are no patents on a split clamp like this, at least none that I can find; and there are at least four clamp manufacturers doing this already. Others will likely follow.

2) They have a different material layout than the traditional clamp designs. This difference is similar to our clamps in that ours are different than traditional clamps as well. However, the material layout in the KTM clamps is somewhat different than ours, particularly on the top clamp, so I'm not sure how they came up with that arrangement.

Xtrig introduced a clamp with a non-traditional material layout a while back, but I haven't seen it for sale anywhere. I suspect they may have canceled that idea as the manufacturing costs go up quite a bit. It was quite different than either the KTM clamps or ours.

I won't publicly speculate on why KTM or Xtrig ended up with a different layout than our clamps (and completely different from one another), but I will say that ours are the result of over 1000 analysis hours with an advanced topology optimization scheme, some serious engineering, and a good amount of physical testing.
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Jmicmoto13
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Jmicmoto13 1/3/2020 4:29pm
1/3/2020 4:29pm
Luxon MX wrote:
Well, these aren't new, they've been out for over a year now. And I believe they're made by Neken as that's who has been making their...
Well, these aren't new, they've been out for over a year now. And I believe they're made by Neken as that's who has been making their clamps in the past. Regardless, there are two main features in the KTM/Husky clamps that make them interesting:

1) They have a split clamping surface, similar to the Xtrig, but not an opposing clamp like the Xtrig. There's no real advantage to the opposing bolts aside from marketing; we've tested it (yes they have a video showing a difference, but I can create a video with two identical clamps having completely different resistance to the bushings too Laughing ).

There are two slight advantages to the split lower clamp, though: it's easier to torque the bolts properly (a non-issue if you know what you're doing on any clamp design), and it allows a smoother transition as the fork tube bends under load, which allows the bushing to slide through a little easier. It's noticeable, but not a huge advantage by any means. This second advantage is only realized on the lower clamp, the upper makes no difference if it's split or not. We've tested all this as well.

There are no patents on a split clamp like this, at least none that I can find; and there are at least four clamp manufacturers doing this already. Others will likely follow.

2) They have a different material layout than the traditional clamp designs. This difference is similar to our clamps in that ours are different than traditional clamps as well. However, the material layout in the KTM clamps is somewhat different than ours, particularly on the top clamp, so I'm not sure how they came up with that arrangement.

Xtrig introduced a clamp with a non-traditional material layout a while back, but I haven't seen it for sale anywhere. I suspect they may have canceled that idea as the manufacturing costs go up quite a bit. It was quite different than either the KTM clamps or ours.

I won't publicly speculate on why KTM or Xtrig ended up with a different layout than our clamps (and completely different from one another), but I will say that ours are the result of over 1000 analysis hours with an advanced topology optimization scheme, some serious engineering, and a good amount of physical testing.
Thanks for the response and information! That was excellent!
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mxryan25
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mxryan25 1/3/2020 5:35pm
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I can’t speak on any performance gains just yet, but they sure do look pretty 😍



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colintrax
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colintrax 1/3/2020 5:53pm
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Breaking news, triple clamps look like triple clamps Grinning
Luxon if you have more material on comparing the different clamps I'd be interesting in reading it. Assuming you dont mind posting Cool
Motofinne
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Motofinne 1/4/2020 8:14am
1/4/2020 8:14am
Interesting that Herlings is still running the solid Neken clamps. What i have gathered thus far is that pretty much all the other factory KTM/Husky riders are on the powerparts clamps.

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Craig_Whitfield 1/4/2020 8:44am
1/4/2020 8:44am
Motofinne wrote:
Interesting that Herlings is still running the solid Neken clamps. What i have gathered thus far is that pretty much all the other factory KTM/Husky riders...
Interesting that Herlings is still running the solid Neken clamps. What i have gathered thus far is that pretty much all the other factory KTM/Husky riders are on the powerparts clamps.

Just noticed this to. Kris keefer was a big fan of the power parts clamp so it would be interesting to know how much different it is to the X trig on the track.
tek14
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tek14 1/4/2020 8:59am
1/4/2020 8:59am
Motofinne wrote:
Interesting that Herlings is still running the solid Neken clamps. What i have gathered thus far is that pretty much all the other factory KTM/Husky riders...
Interesting that Herlings is still running the solid Neken clamps. What i have gathered thus far is that pretty much all the other factory KTM/Husky riders are on the powerparts clamps.

He needs more rigid clamps while he is riding so much faster! Wink
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Luxon MX
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Luxon MX 1/4/2020 10:32am
1/4/2020 10:32am
tek14 wrote:
He needs more rigid clamps while he is riding so much faster! Wink
The Neken clamps are very similar to stock KTM clamps (not the powerparts), which are super flexy. The Powerparts clamps are almost certainly stiffer. Ironically, more stiffness can results in a more plush feel as it keeps everything better aligned.
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