Will the big 4 ever make a 350?

Pirate421
Profile picture for user Pirate421
Posts
1818
Joined
7/26/2015
Location
MA US
Pirate421
Edited Date/Time 12/17/2018 5:05am
I’ve always wondered this since Ktm and husky have been so successful with the 350 since it came out. I’ve personally had. ‘17 350 and thought it was the best bike I’d ever ridden and would be pumped if Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki or Kawi all had one what racing might be like, but I don’t want to go down that rabbit hole.

What got me thinking about it again was I was reading the December 2017 issue of Dirtbike Magazine and the 2018 Ktm 350sxf. They wrote “right now, KTM and it’s blood brother Husqvarna produce the only 350s, but that WILL change”. Is that subtle foreshadowing or maybe just a guess statement from them? And would anyone Switch to a 350 if their favorite mfg made one?
|
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
4467
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA US
yz133rider 2/26/2018 6:42pm
2/26/2018 6:42pm
The fact they havent shows they're asleep at the wheel.

I love my husky 350 easily the perfect bike for me
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
4467
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA US
yz133rider 2/26/2018 6:43pm
2/26/2018 6:43pm
It was 2010 or 2011 when ktm introd the 350 and if im not mistaken its their most popular size sales wise

Its an amazing bike.
Bruneval
Profile picture for user Bruneval
Posts
574
Joined
6/7/2016
Location
Bristol GB
Bruneval 2/26/2018 6:44pm
2/26/2018 6:44pm
I think a Husky 350 will be my next bike when the ‘19s come out.
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
4467
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA US
yz133rider 2/26/2018 6:44pm
2/26/2018 6:44pm
Bruneval wrote:
I think a Husky 350 will be my next bike when the ‘19s come out.
Do it.

The Shop

See All »
Pirate421
Profile picture for user Pirate421
Posts
1818
Joined
7/26/2015
Location
MA US
Pirate421 2/26/2018 6:47pm
2/26/2018 6:47pm
They really are the perfect bike I think. More than enough power and super light. I hope what dirtbike wrote is true and the other manufacturers step up but will they be 5 years behind Ktm when/if they do come out or are they learning as Ktm does all the R&D?
mb60
Profile picture for user mb60
Posts
4743
Joined
3/7/2010
Location
GRAPEVINE, TX US
mb60 2/26/2018 6:48pm
2/26/2018 6:48pm
If I had to bet on which 4 would make one. It would be Yamaha for sure.
2
Wells423
Profile picture for user Wells423
Posts
357
Joined
4/1/2017
Location
Granbury, TX US
Wells423 2/26/2018 6:56pm
2/26/2018 6:56pm
Switched to a 15 350 sxf a while back and I love it. My next bike will be an 18 husky. I don’t understand how the big 4 don’t see the market share they’re loosing. Tons of vet riders that actually purchase new bikes love the middle cc bike. I’d love to see Yamaha or Honda build a vet bike.
Pirate421
Profile picture for user Pirate421
Posts
1818
Joined
7/26/2015
Location
MA US
Pirate421 2/26/2018 7:12pm
2/26/2018 7:12pm
All the threads lately about injuries and, justin starling making the main on a 250 last week and the 250 sx often running just as quick or sometimes quicker lap times has me thinking the 450s may start to be working against themselves. We’ve heard from guys like barcia saying that the jgr 450 was a bit too much indoors and out, cairoli proved that the 350 could win in the gps. We basically can all come to the conclusion that everyone rides a 450 because it’s a “marketing tool for the premier class”. Yes they may initially be at a disadvantage early in a race but most amateurs and vets I know benefit from a smaller bike and haven’t met anyone who doesn’t like the 350. Unfortunately a lot of people feel just because they don’t have the biggest and fastest bike made, they are at a disadvantage.
jorgechavez 2/26/2018 7:12pm
2/26/2018 7:12pm
I personally doubt it, I'm sure the 350s are awesome bikes but it's a bit of a niche bike within a niche market, if that makes any sense. I feel like most people will want to get the most bang for their buck, which on paper is a 450.
Forty
Profile picture for user Forty
Posts
2804
Joined
7/27/2009
Location
Saint Paul, MN US
Forty 2/26/2018 7:28pm
2/26/2018 7:28pm
Yamaha will do it. And I’ll buy one.

Next year when the yz250f gets e-start it may become the best mx bike available.
Pirate421
Profile picture for user Pirate421
Posts
1818
Joined
7/26/2015
Location
MA US
Pirate421 2/26/2018 7:30pm
2/26/2018 7:30pm
Another avenue a 350 opens up is the off-road market that they are missing out on. Most 350s I see for sale are XCF models. On the east coast with more single track and woodsy riding a 450 Just about never necessary and that’s why I think you don’t see as many green, red and yellow bikes at gncc and enduros. The woods is where I think the 350 power plant shines almost as much as on the amateur mx circuit
MX915
Profile picture for user MX915
Posts
469
Joined
1/17/2018
Location
Central, NJ US
MX915 2/26/2018 7:33pm
2/26/2018 7:33pm
I think the Japanese manufacturers believe you should be thanking them for taking time out of their schedule of building cars, trains, and pianos to build you a dirtbike that is probably .1% of their overall revenue.

I wouldn't hold my breath. Sad
2
kkawboy14
Profile picture for user kkawboy14
Posts
11494
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
TX US
kkawboy14 2/26/2018 7:37pm
2/26/2018 7:37pm
By the time they do the 3 guys that want one will have graduated to 450s or went down to 125 2 strokes
Johnny89superbike 2/26/2018 7:40pm
2/26/2018 7:40pm
I'm 58 and carrying many injuries, currently riding a modded 2011 RMZ450, I was thinking the big bike was too much for me; I rode a mates 2013 KTM350 the other day, maybe it needed a pipe or something, I was a little disappointed in the performance; no peak like a 250, just broad gutless power, no peaks or troughs. Got back on my 450 and loved it more.

If the Japs build one, I wonder if a peaky 250 type power is the go or make tractor type power? Personally I'm thinking that a 'de-stroke' of a 450 might work? The longer the stroke, the larger the flywheels, hence more gyroscopic mass to change directions. This is so noticeable when comparing a 600 to a 1000 on the roadrace track, bikes weigh basically the same but a 600 can change direction so much easier at speed; it's all physics.

Pit Row

See All »
JB 19
Profile picture for user JB 19
Posts
4205
Joined
3/8/2009
Location
Marion, OH US
JB 19 2/26/2018 7:50pm
2/26/2018 7:50pm
It's the perfect engine size for most people and has a better effect on the chassis than a 450.
Dirty Points 2/26/2018 7:53pm
2/26/2018 7:53pm Edited Date/Time 2/26/2018 7:54pm
Johnny89superbike wrote:
I'm 58 and carrying many injuries, currently riding a modded 2011 RMZ450, I was thinking the big bike was too much for me; I rode a...
I'm 58 and carrying many injuries, currently riding a modded 2011 RMZ450, I was thinking the big bike was too much for me; I rode a mates 2013 KTM350 the other day, maybe it needed a pipe or something, I was a little disappointed in the performance; no peak like a 250, just broad gutless power, no peaks or troughs. Got back on my 450 and loved it more.

If the Japs build one, I wonder if a peaky 250 type power is the go or make tractor type power? Personally I'm thinking that a 'de-stroke' of a 450 might work? The longer the stroke, the larger the flywheels, hence more gyroscopic mass to change directions. This is so noticeable when comparing a 600 to a 1000 on the roadrace track, bikes weigh basically the same but a 600 can change direction so much easier at speed; it's all physics.
Have you seen how far oversquare current generation 450s already are?
kkawboy14
Profile picture for user kkawboy14
Posts
11494
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
TX US
kkawboy14 2/26/2018 7:54pm
2/26/2018 7:54pm
If a guy knows how to ride, clutch not throttle, he can ride anything!
Johnny Depp
Profile picture for user Johnny Depp
Posts
6438
Joined
10/16/2014
Location
Buda, TX US
Johnny Depp 2/26/2018 7:59pm
2/26/2018 7:59pm Edited Date/Time 2/26/2018 8:08pm
Why does everything have to revolve around the so called Big 4?

EnduroGP World Champion Beta has been making 350's as long as KTM ,2011, and currently makes a dual injector model that is a step up in tech from what KTM is running, and offers a 390 and a 430 and a 480. They may have lights, but they don't have to apologize for their performance.

https://www.totalmotorcycle.com/motorcycles/2018/2018-beta-350rr-race-e…


Racerxx
Profile picture for user Racerxx
Posts
87
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Canyon Country, CA US
Racerxx 2/26/2018 8:06pm
2/26/2018 8:06pm
smashingpumpkins167 wrote:
I would be first in line for a Yamaha 350
mattyhamz2 wrote:
I’d be right behind you! I would love a yz350
I hope you guys are talking about a YZ 350 two stroke I'd put down a deposit today
1
Pirate421
Profile picture for user Pirate421
Posts
1818
Joined
7/26/2015
Location
MA US
Pirate421 2/26/2018 8:07pm
2/26/2018 8:07pm Edited Date/Time 2/26/2018 8:14pm
Johnny Depp wrote:
Why does everything have to revolve around the so called Big 4? EnduroGP World Champion Beta has been making 350's as long as KTM ,2011, and...
Why does everything have to revolve around the so called Big 4?

EnduroGP World Champion Beta has been making 350's as long as KTM ,2011, and currently makes a dual injector model that is a step up in tech from what KTM is running, and offers a 390 and a 430 and a 480. They may have lights, but they don't have to apologize for their performance.

https://www.totalmotorcycle.com/motorcycles/2018/2018-beta-350rr-race-e…


There’s a myriad of reasons I left the beta and Sherco out of this original thread. But the main being that I wanted to bring up what I read in the magazine which was related to the 350sxf motocross model which beta do not make. I know members historically like to debate the beta is a capable mx machine but please for the sake of this thread, it does not apply.

Now for off-road the beta is a viable option but they are more of the niche within a niche. Their us off-road presence I feel has started to slip after losing a few teams and I don’t see them as being anywhere near half the level as the other brands mentioned.

I am mostly concerned with mx models here and the now big 6, two of which make 350s, which leaves the big 4 who do not.
SwingHard
Profile picture for user SwingHard
Posts
485
Joined
3/14/2017
Location
Sacramento, CA US
SwingHard 2/26/2018 8:17pm
2/26/2018 8:17pm
Pirate421 wrote:
All the threads lately about injuries and, justin starling making the main on a 250 last week and the 250 sx often running just as quick...
All the threads lately about injuries and, justin starling making the main on a 250 last week and the 250 sx often running just as quick or sometimes quicker lap times has me thinking the 450s may start to be working against themselves. We’ve heard from guys like barcia saying that the jgr 450 was a bit too much indoors and out, cairoli proved that the 350 could win in the gps. We basically can all come to the conclusion that everyone rides a 450 because it’s a “marketing tool for the premier class”. Yes they may initially be at a disadvantage early in a race but most amateurs and vets I know benefit from a smaller bike and haven’t met anyone who doesn’t like the 350. Unfortunately a lot of people feel just because they don’t have the biggest and fastest bike made, they are at a disadvantage.
I may be " the guy" who didn't gel with the 350. I wanted to see what all the hype was about,so I bought a 17' Husky FC-350. First couple of rides, thought it was great! After that,the honeymoon was over quick! Sold it with 6 hours on it,picked up a 17' CRF-450,I couldn't be happier.
I still wonder why I didn't fall in love with it?When everything I read says its the best vet bike you can buy.
fullfloater
Profile picture for user fullfloater
Posts
3222
Joined
7/22/2009
Location
CA US
Fantasy
10th
fullfloater 2/26/2018 8:39pm
2/26/2018 8:39pm
What are the plans for the 2019 ktm/husq 350? I heard something about a torquier motor. I like the YZ250F power delivery and would jump at a similar powerband 350. Not too interested in a 15k RPM 350.
yz133rider
Profile picture for user yz133rider
Posts
4467
Joined
8/1/2013
Location
Avondale, PA US
yz133rider 2/26/2018 8:49pm
2/26/2018 8:49pm
fullfloater wrote:
What are the plans for the 2019 ktm/husq 350? I heard something about a torquier motor. I like the YZ250F power delivery and would jump at...
What are the plans for the 2019 ktm/husq 350? I heard something about a torquier motor. I like the YZ250F power delivery and would jump at a similar powerband 350. Not too interested in a 15k RPM 350.
I hope they dont ruin a good thing how it builds power now is great. And mxa and others overstate how the low end is weak.
NeedMoto
Profile picture for user NeedMoto
Posts
701
Joined
8/6/2015
Location
Lincoln, CA US
NeedMoto 2/26/2018 8:51pm
2/26/2018 8:51pm
Pirate421 wrote:
All the threads lately about injuries and, justin starling making the main on a 250 last week and the 250 sx often running just as quick...
All the threads lately about injuries and, justin starling making the main on a 250 last week and the 250 sx often running just as quick or sometimes quicker lap times has me thinking the 450s may start to be working against themselves. We’ve heard from guys like barcia saying that the jgr 450 was a bit too much indoors and out, cairoli proved that the 350 could win in the gps. We basically can all come to the conclusion that everyone rides a 450 because it’s a “marketing tool for the premier class”. Yes they may initially be at a disadvantage early in a race but most amateurs and vets I know benefit from a smaller bike and haven’t met anyone who doesn’t like the 350. Unfortunately a lot of people feel just because they don’t have the biggest and fastest bike made, they are at a disadvantage.
SwingHard wrote:
I may be " the guy" who didn't gel with the 350. I wanted to see what all the hype was about,so I bought a 17'...
I may be " the guy" who didn't gel with the 350. I wanted to see what all the hype was about,so I bought a 17' Husky FC-350. First couple of rides, thought it was great! After that,the honeymoon was over quick! Sold it with 6 hours on it,picked up a 17' CRF-450,I couldn't be happier.
I still wonder why I didn't fall in love with it?When everything I read says its the best vet bike you can buy.
I'm "the other guy" that hasn't gelled with the 350. Bought an 18 KTM 350 a month ago. 58 years old, strictly moto.
I get around the track much better on a 450, as I ride in the low end torque curve.

I wanted to test my curiosity, did and moving on.

It's not about one bike being better than the other, it's about whatever your most comfortable on.

Mine has 4 hours on it. It's going up for sale soon.
Motofinne
Profile picture for user Motofinne
Posts
10686
Joined
1/4/2014
Location
FI
Motofinne 2/26/2018 8:58pm
2/26/2018 8:58pm
I wonder why the 350 has a reputation of being a weekend warrior/vet rider bike? The current gen(16-18) 350 makes more HP than the KXF 450 and RMZ 450. I think it's clearly fast enough to be competitive with other 450s in the right hands.

https://www.vitalmx.com/stories/non-public/38
gsxr6
Profile picture for user gsxr6
Posts
1956
Joined
9/3/2011
Location
Anderson, CA US
gsxr6 2/26/2018 9:15pm
2/26/2018 9:15pm
It revs sooooooo slow. Wasn't impressed with the 15 sxf350 I rode. Yea it revved, but talk about flat. I too loved my 450s better after.

Post a reply to: Will the big 4 ever make a 350?