Global warming?

Hut
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12/6/2017 12:43pm
Hut wrote:
Who needs science when we got vital non moto.
Titan1 wrote:
Who can trust science when its been politicized beyond recognition?
Like Non Moto! Laughing
ToolMaker
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12/6/2017 12:56pm
The problem is that a few radical scientists drown out anybody with opposing view. So it seems that nobody disagrees which is not true. Then all the young impressionable minds get indoctrinated.
I remember when the science was settled the earth was cooling and we would need to cover the glaciers with ash to absorb warmth to stop the cooling.
ToolMaker
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12/6/2017 1:01pm
ToolMaker wrote:
So 2 deg was a random #, but the reality is it would be different. But the reference to a broken farming system, warmer temp means...
So 2 deg was a random #, but the reality is it would be different. But the reference to a broken farming system, warmer temp means longer growing season=more production. So we have to give up NY? Maybe that goes in the plus column? Whistling
But in reality, there is not enough real data (not fake data) to get all high and mighty.
TM
APLMAN99 wrote:
I'm not sure which crops would benefit greatly from a longer growing season. Perhaps a few like alfalfa, that has multiple cuttings, etc. It wouldn't help...
I'm not sure which crops would benefit greatly from a longer growing season. Perhaps a few like alfalfa, that has multiple cuttings, etc. It wouldn't help most tree and vine crops, they have one crop per year no matter what. Warmer temperatures might screw up the ability of trees to chill enough to go through the necessary dormancy period, actually. Warmer winter temperatures have a direct impact on pests overwintering and emerging in greater quantities the next season, so it's likely that pesticide usage would need to rise greatly to combat that increase.

There could be some improvements in rising CO2 numbers, but the increased heat would likely cause plants to shut down earlier in the day than normal so that could be either a net positive or a negative, hard to say.....
What? Somebody dare imput real information that's useful to the conversation? Say it aint so.
Thanks apl for intellegent info
early
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12/6/2017 1:09pm
ToolMaker wrote:
The problem is that a few radical scientists drown out anybody with opposing view. So it seems that nobody disagrees which is not true. Then all...
The problem is that a few radical scientists drown out anybody with opposing view. So it seems that nobody disagrees which is not true. Then all the young impressionable minds get indoctrinated.
I remember when the science was settled the earth was cooling and we would need to cover the glaciers with ash to absorb warmth to stop the cooling.
The problem is there aretoo many people that have either shared views or opposing views. Niether side is 100%correct but far too few are willing to admit that.

The Shop

APLMAN99
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12/6/2017 1:12pm
ToolMaker wrote:
So 2 deg was a random #, but the reality is it would be different. But the reference to a broken farming system, warmer temp means...
So 2 deg was a random #, but the reality is it would be different. But the reference to a broken farming system, warmer temp means longer growing season=more production. So we have to give up NY? Maybe that goes in the plus column? Whistling
But in reality, there is not enough real data (not fake data) to get all high and mighty.
TM
APLMAN99 wrote:
I'm not sure which crops would benefit greatly from a longer growing season. Perhaps a few like alfalfa, that has multiple cuttings, etc. It wouldn't help...
I'm not sure which crops would benefit greatly from a longer growing season. Perhaps a few like alfalfa, that has multiple cuttings, etc. It wouldn't help most tree and vine crops, they have one crop per year no matter what. Warmer temperatures might screw up the ability of trees to chill enough to go through the necessary dormancy period, actually. Warmer winter temperatures have a direct impact on pests overwintering and emerging in greater quantities the next season, so it's likely that pesticide usage would need to rise greatly to combat that increase.

There could be some improvements in rising CO2 numbers, but the increased heat would likely cause plants to shut down earlier in the day than normal so that could be either a net positive or a negative, hard to say.....
ToolMaker wrote:
What? Somebody dare imput real information that's useful to the conversation? Say it aint so.
Thanks apl for intellegent info
I don't know if it's that useful, though. There's not much of a chance that we can totally comprehend all the changing variables that would occur.

Big changes in climate would likely have some huge changes in farming, because the crops and methods we use are ones that have been developed using a relatively stable climate as their backdrop. Quick changes in that environment don't allow us to "evolve" our farming methods or products to compensate for those changes. Right now a single bad season can be disastrous for production, string 5-10 of those large change seasons in a row and it could really destroy our food supply.

SCR
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12/6/2017 1:40pm
SCR wrote:
2 degrees warmer from what reference ?
I need more words in your question to understand what you're asking.
kongols wrote:
From year 1880. Industrial revolution.
Global avg temp in 1880 was 57 deg. F. Today it is about 58.3 F. Uncertainty is about 0.5 deg F. So that's about 1.3 degF change since 1880 give or take .05 deg. uncertainty. Or about 0.8 deg C. since 1880.

So New York should be half underwater ? If you go back to about 1600 global temp was about 56deg F. So its changed about 2.5 degF in about 600 yrs. Before 1600 it was warmer than it is now.



kongols
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12/6/2017 1:51pm Edited Date/Time 12/6/2017 2:02pm
I need more words in your question to understand what you're asking.
kongols wrote:
From year 1880. Industrial revolution.
SCR wrote:
Global avg temp in 1880 was 57 deg. F. Today it is about 58.3 F. Uncertainty is about 0.5 deg F. So that's about 1.3 degF...
Global avg temp in 1880 was 57 deg. F. Today it is about 58.3 F. Uncertainty is about 0.5 deg F. So that's about 1.3 degF change since 1880 give or take .05 deg. uncertainty. Or about 0.8 deg C. since 1880.

So New York should be half underwater ? If you go back to about 1600 global temp was about 56deg F. So its changed about 2.5 degF in about 600 yrs. Before 1600 it was warmer than it is now.



That`s about right. And tit`s almost unavoidable that we will reach 2 degrees by year 2100. It is climbing at the pace never seen before. No one argues that Earth does it`s own thing. Ice age, etc. But the rate it goes up right now is alarming.
Sea level rose 8 inches since 1880. It could rise up to 48 inches by 2100(most likely will). Look at it as a snowball going downhill and getting bigger.
2 degrees is what is manageable. After that it`s avalanche.

Disclaimer.
As usual- it`s all projections. Deniers will say that Earth did that before , etc. Problem is that it will change the way we live faster than we can adapt.
G-man
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12/6/2017 9:50pm
Heh heh, you like Carlin's comedy but you think he crossed the line with plastic bags? Smile

https://youtu.be/fwMukKqx-Os
Oh man Carlin is classic I've never seen that one good stuff! Grinning
G-man
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12/6/2017 9:53pm
Hut wrote:
I don't think Hunger is funny either.
https://youtu.be/eQQ2btbidWE?t=3m43s
All time classic that was Sam Kinison's first show on HBO that launched him it was the Rodney Dangerfield show on HBO.
I have it on VCR made copies and sent it to friends they loved him. Grinning
Shawn142
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12/7/2017 10:47am
APLMAN99 wrote:
I don't know if it's that useful, though. There's not much of a chance that we can totally comprehend all the changing variables that would occur...
I don't know if it's that useful, though. There's not much of a chance that we can totally comprehend all the changing variables that would occur.

Big changes in climate would likely have some huge changes in farming, because the crops and methods we use are ones that have been developed using a relatively stable climate as their backdrop. Quick changes in that environment don't allow us to "evolve" our farming methods or products to compensate for those changes. Right now a single bad season can be disastrous for production, string 5-10 of those large change seasons in a row and it could really destroy our food supply.

More or less the point I was after. I'm no climate scientist but the ones I've listend to don't warn of terrible storms or the real life version of Waterworld. Small changes in climate that happen quicker than an ecosystem can adapt means a much higher chance of collapse. And the main thing I've seen every climate scientist points to is our ability to consistently grow food as those changes become more rapid.
newmann
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12/8/2017 5:05am
Damn this global warming



markit
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12/10/2017 6:34pm
Dr Roy Spencer.
12/10/2017 6:35pm
Newman that’s not climate change when you say it. That’s just weather patterns.

But if that was a boat in a more northern spot on a sunny day then of course it’s climate change and not weather patterns. Whistling
Hut
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12/10/2017 6:42pm Edited Date/Time 12/10/2017 6:43pm
Let's hear it from a real expert. Blink


ToolMaker
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12/10/2017 7:11pm
newmann wrote:
Damn this global warming [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/12/08/230307/s1200_B9BE2F5E_2380_48F0_A9C4_A39182AECB87.jpg[/img]
Damn this global warming



Watch the thread go off on crop circles now Shocked
Hut
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12/10/2017 8:10pm
Texas 4 months



Hut
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12/10/2017 8:15pm
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kongols
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12/12/2017 5:21am
Patrick Moore claims he is an environmentalist and represents an independent scientific perspective on forest issues.

TRUTH: Moore was paid by the British Columbia Forest Alliance, an industry-front group set up by the public relations firm Burson-Marsteller (the same PR firm that represented Exxon after the Valdez oil spill and Union Carbide after the Bhopal chemical disaster). The BC Forest Alliance is funded primarily by the
logging industry. He also has ties to other corporations including Monsanto and Weyerhaeuser.
kongols
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12/12/2017 5:23am
Patrick Moore often misrepresents himself in the media as an environmental “expert” or even an “environmentalist,” while offering anti-environmental opinions on a wide range of issues and taking a distinctly anti-environmental stance. He also exploits long-gone ties with Greenpeace to sell himself as a speaker and pro-corporate spokesperson, usually taking positions that Greenpeace opposes.

While it is true that Patrick Moore was a member of Greenpeace in the 1970s, in 1986 he abruptly turned his back on the very issues he once passionately defended. He claims he “saw the light” but what Moore really saw was an opportunity for financial gain. Since then he has gone from defender of the planet to a paid representative of corporate polluters.

Patrick Moore promotes such anti-environmental positions as clearcut logging, nuclear power, farmed salmon, PVC (vinyl) production, genetically engineered crops, and mining. Clients for his consulting services are a veritable Who’s Who of companies that Greenpeace has exposed for environmental misdeeds, including Monsanto, Weyerhaeuser, and BHP Minerals.

Moore’s claims run from the exaggerated to the outrageous to the downright false, including that “clear-cutting is good for forests” and Three Mile Island was actually “a success story” because the radiation from the partially melted core was contained. That is akin to saying “my car crash was a success because I only cracked my skull and didn’t die.”

By exploiting his former ties to Greenpeace, Moore portrays himself as a prodigal son who has seen the error of his ways. Unfortunately, the media – especially conservative media – give him a platform for his views, and often do so without mentioning the fact that he is a paid spokesperson for polluting companies.
JAFO92
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12/12/2017 5:28am Edited Date/Time 12/12/2017 5:29am

kongols
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12/12/2017 5:31am Edited Date/Time 12/12/2017 5:33am
Wink
You got to do background checks Racer, you got to.
JAFO92
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12/12/2017 5:40am
kongols wrote:
Wink
You got to do background checks Racer, you got to.
You obviously over-estimate my level of give-a-shit on the entire 'climate change' discussion. I dont care one bit about any of the talking heads on either side of the stupid 'debate'. Its like two fleas arguing which one owns the dog.

I have a big pile of old tires Im gonna light off to burn a pile of old trees, I will video it and post it later this winter!. Kissing

kongols
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12/12/2017 5:42am
kongols wrote:
Wink
You got to do background checks Racer, you got to.
JAFO92 wrote:
You obviously over-estimate my level of give-a-shit on the entire 'climate change' discussion. I dont care one bit about any of the talking heads on either...
You obviously over-estimate my level of give-a-shit on the entire 'climate change' discussion. I dont care one bit about any of the talking heads on either side of the stupid 'debate'. Its like two fleas arguing which one owns the dog.

I have a big pile of old tires Im gonna light off to burn a pile of old trees, I will video it and post it later this winter!. Kissing

LaughingLaughingLaughing
newmann
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12/12/2017 5:54am
kongols wrote:
Wink
You got to do background checks Racer, you got to.
JAFO92 wrote:
You obviously over-estimate my level of give-a-shit on the entire 'climate change' discussion. I dont care one bit about any of the talking heads on either...
You obviously over-estimate my level of give-a-shit on the entire 'climate change' discussion. I dont care one bit about any of the talking heads on either side of the stupid 'debate'. Its like two fleas arguing which one owns the dog.

I have a big pile of old tires Im gonna light off to burn a pile of old trees, I will video it and post it later this winter!. Kissing

And here I am paying 10 bucks a tire to have them properly disposed of. More of that "cleaning other people's messes up" thing that I seem to do a lot of. Should have just poured a little diesel on and struck a match...accidentally of course. Laughing

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