YZ 465 43mm cartridge forks?

wertman194
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wertman194
Ok, so I know on my Honda CR480 the hot ticket is to install a set of 86 cartridge internals in the stock 43mm forks. Question is, for the Yammies can you install the later 490 cartridge internals in the 81 465 forks?
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oldsocalmxr
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oldsocalmxr 5/9/2018 2:43pm
5/9/2018 2:43pm
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring rates and oil levels.....no joy. Sent them to Clark at Noleen.....best decision I could have made. I was so impressed, I had him re-valve the shock as well. Bike is now well balanced, and confidence inspiring. Well worth itCool
450exc115
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450exc115 5/10/2018 10:45am
5/10/2018 10:45am
wertman194 wrote:
Ok, so I know on my Honda CR480 the hot ticket is to install a set of 86 cartridge internals in the stock 43mm forks. Question...
Ok, so I know on my Honda CR480 the hot ticket is to install a set of 86 cartridge internals in the stock 43mm forks. Question is, for the Yammies can you install the later 490 cartridge internals in the 81 465 forks?
I believe the answer is yes but I think you need to drill out the bottom of the fork leg to be able to install the BV adjuster of the later year forks. I have a set of 87 YZ250 forks that I plan to convert over using my 81 YZ465 forks. One thing I need to check is bottoming cone against the 87 chrome uppers.
Smed
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Smed 5/10/2018 8:12pm
5/10/2018 8:12pm
oldsocalmxr wrote:
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring...
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring rates and oil levels.....no joy. Sent them to Clark at Noleen.....best decision I could have made. I was so impressed, I had him re-valve the shock as well. Bike is now well balanced, and confidence inspiring. Well worth itCool
I guess we all get different results, I have RT emulators & springs to suit my weight in a pair of 81 YZ465 forks & they work great.
Smed
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Smed 5/10/2018 8:14pm
5/10/2018 8:14pm
I would recommend Noleen too, I have a set of his Marty Tripes V shocks, he set them up spot on.

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MaxPower
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MaxPower 5/11/2018 5:54am
5/11/2018 5:54am
is it just my experience or has Noleen not shipped the suspension back when promised? ive had to use suspension guys I didn't like nearly as much because I didnt want to do the dance .Its a shame because I found someone who's work I'm so happy with
oldsocalmxr
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oldsocalmxr 5/11/2018 9:10am
5/11/2018 9:10am
MaxPower wrote:
is it just my experience or has Noleen not shipped the suspension back when promised? ive had to use suspension guys I didn't like nearly as...
is it just my experience or has Noleen not shipped the suspension back when promised? ive had to use suspension guys I didn't like nearly as much because I didnt want to do the dance .Its a shame because I found someone who's work I'm so happy with
I'm sure that all of the specialty shops have their problems...... I've been in the business since 1975, so I have seen pretty much all of the issues. I had one outfit "lose" my shocks for almost two weeks.... turns out they were sitting on the floor at the receptionist desk. I had to do the paper trail work to find them. All I can put forth is the fact that my front end, correctly sprung and valved had the worst mid-stroke spike I have ever experienced. Clark knew exactly what I was talking about and rectified it completely, not to mention I can now run modern oils in the fork. If you find a boutique shop you are happy with , by all means stay with them. Wink
450exc115
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450exc115 5/11/2018 1:35pm
5/11/2018 1:35pm
oldsocalmxr wrote:
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring...
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring rates and oil levels.....no joy. Sent them to Clark at Noleen.....best decision I could have made. I was so impressed, I had him re-valve the shock as well. Bike is now well balanced, and confidence inspiring. Well worth itCool
Did he still use the emulators or did he find another set of damper cylinders and pull the racetech parts. I ask as the old school forks are very simple. Fork compresses and oil flows through a hole and the restriction pushes back on the Chrome fork tube collapsing. Bigger the hole the less force pushing back. Drill holes up and down the damper and the fork changes over the stroke. Cartridge emulators basically replace the holes with a spring loaded valve and the spring rate and tension meter the oil flow and generate the compression force. The damping rate is now variable as the orifice size can change based on bump size and speed (speed sensitive verse position sensitive damping). They work well when setup. The other biggest contributor is oil height as that controls the air spring (position sensitive). A lot of folks tune that for bottoming resistance which IMO should be done with bottoming cones or other hydraulic bottoming devices. I run low oil levels as I find in the smaller fork diameters are more prone to mid stroke issues due to the smaller available air volumes in the fork and the faster ramp up of the air spring..
wertman194
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wertman194 5/12/2018 5:11am
5/12/2018 5:11am
oldsocalmxr wrote:
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring...
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring rates and oil levels.....no joy. Sent them to Clark at Noleen.....best decision I could have made. I was so impressed, I had him re-valve the shock as well. Bike is now well balanced, and confidence inspiring. Well worth itCool
Smed wrote:
I guess we all get different results, I have RT emulators & springs to suit my weight in a pair of 81 YZ465 forks & they...
I guess we all get different results, I have RT emulators & springs to suit my weight in a pair of 81 YZ465 forks & they work great.
I do already have a set of 490 forks with emulators and they work ok, but I had the same scenario on my CR480 and then changed the emulators over to the cartridge internals and was twice the fork. There just was no comparison and was hoping for the same results with the YZ.
oldsocalmxr
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oldsocalmxr 5/12/2018 9:40am
5/12/2018 9:40am Edited Date/Time 5/12/2018 9:43am
oldsocalmxr wrote:
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring...
Just throwing this out there...... I have an '84 YZ 250. The forks were valved and sprung with emulators. They were horrible. I verified the spring rates and oil levels.....no joy. Sent them to Clark at Noleen.....best decision I could have made. I was so impressed, I had him re-valve the shock as well. Bike is now well balanced, and confidence inspiring. Well worth itCool
450exc115 wrote:
Did he still use the emulators or did he find another set of damper cylinders and pull the racetech parts. I ask as the old school...
Did he still use the emulators or did he find another set of damper cylinders and pull the racetech parts. I ask as the old school forks are very simple. Fork compresses and oil flows through a hole and the restriction pushes back on the Chrome fork tube collapsing. Bigger the hole the less force pushing back. Drill holes up and down the damper and the fork changes over the stroke. Cartridge emulators basically replace the holes with a spring loaded valve and the spring rate and tension meter the oil flow and generate the compression force. The damping rate is now variable as the orifice size can change based on bump size and speed (speed sensitive verse position sensitive damping). They work well when setup. The other biggest contributor is oil height as that controls the air spring (position sensitive). A lot of folks tune that for bottoming resistance which IMO should be done with bottoming cones or other hydraulic bottoming devices. I run low oil levels as I find in the smaller fork diameters are more prone to mid stroke issues due to the smaller available air volumes in the fork and the faster ramp up of the air spring..
From what I understand, everything was removed. The dampening rods were modified to use 5wt suspension fluid. The forks are very tune-able with fluid levels. I tried air pressure for gp's..... big mistake. Spring rate and oil level only. Clark has a mod he uses from back in the day...... did not go into great detail about the why too's and where for's. I simply told him the symptoms and my expectations...... he did a great job. Running air in the forks was a stopgap measure. Unless you got very sophisticated with separation chambers and other such things, it wasn't worth the effort. We tried all that in the '70's with very mixed results. The most reliable system is as you stated.....tune with hydraulics. Cool

BTW..... I did not opt for the hard anodizing on my lowers. I have realized I am no longer as fast as I once was......
they work very well for my current skill level

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